Mike Dessin's Protocol.

[annie]

I have read on line and on blogs about this very hard line approach which, though incredibly tough, seems to be getting some amazing results. Mike himself was almost given up for dead, he was so very ill, and yet he is now, seemingly, 100% fit and, bless him, being very vocal about c.f.s. it's severity and the need for support and research.
Much of the technical stuff about his dr's protocol and the things that people following his example are doing are way beyond my scope of knowledge, it is certainly not for the faint hearted, of that I am sure.
Does anyone have any information on this? I'm in the U.K, I haven't heard of anyone following it here.

[StarDust]

If it's one of those yoga and nutrition protocol my advice would be don't waste your time.
Sorry for being an jerk but these "doctors"(some of them don't have a Ph.D and call themselves doctors) make me angry when they make a book claiming they have to cure to CFS knowing everyone ill will buy it because we are desperate. I feel like they are using the fact that we would do anything to get better to make money selling their books. Or may be I just find it insane thinking you will cure CFS with meditation.

[neil25]

yeah i hate when books claim this, its a complete joke to think meditation can cure cfs. It can help improve health but to say it cures cfs is crazy.

[Chronicfatiguetreatments]

I read about it a little bit. His doctor uses, acupuncture, homeopathic medicine, biopuncture(i have no idea what that is), and autohemotherapy (which is "the immediate intramuscular or subcutaneous reinjection of freshly drawn autologous blood").

That guy was pretty messed up, i think they said he had a collapsed lung, and some kind of cardiac failure.

But,ive already done so much alternative treatments that have never worked, i think im going to stick to traditional medicine now. Hopefully they will a traditional treatment that i can use soon.

[billoddie]

please understand this is only my opinion. 1) Most of the world is suffering fatigue. Its almost the number one complaint doctors hear. We know it isnt cfs. Most peoples fatigue could be cured by diet change, lifestyle changes etc. We have(had to) all done that. 2) Next, there are people with chronic fatigue This is NOT cfs. These people are sick...maybe iron deficient or have some underlying organic cause. And it might be severe and serious. Find it and bingo, fatigue gets better. 3) Then there is Chronic fatigue...syndrome (CFS). This is different. Really different. This is the crushing, cruelling fatigue that most of here know about. The type that remains after 10 yrs and $100, 000 later. The type that defies accurate description and that "normal" people have no freakin idea about, despite them proclaiming, "oh yeah, I know what its like to be tired"... People, or doctors who say, do this or do that, take this or take that, do not and have not had cfs. They were just chronically fatigued. I truly believe that CFS comes from that bloody amygdala...that disproportionate, crazy stress response that so many of us have. Thats why we say, "but I dont want to do ANYTHING". Because that ANYTHING is stressful. Just living becomes stressful for us. Thats why we chase symptoms for years and get virtually nowhere. Thats why we have hundreds of dollars of supplements that JUST keep us in the game. With the amygdala in a constant panic, the body become its own symptom making factory. We all need to ascertain which category we fall into. I can virtually guarantee Dessin was not in category 3.

[Chronicfatiguetreatments]

I can virtually guarantee Dessin was not in category 3.

I would have to agree. I try not to judge people, because i know people are constantly doing that to me.
But i feel (after trying every alternative treatment possible), that people who are totally cured by alternative treatments, have a different type cfs. Maybe they are a subgroup that have something like mitochonrial dysfunction, or some type of hormonal problems, or HPA axis dysfunction. But i feel like what i have isn't gonna go away with alternative treatments.
I did read about Mike Dessin and he did sound really, really sick, but i feel like it was different from what i have.

[billoddie]

yes, I agree about the judgement thing. And its something we have to be careful of as you say. Its just that after you have read so many books that proclaim some sort of cure, and you realize that the info in them is just kindergarten and you have tried all the so called cures before. This is the syndrome part...that bit that makes our bodies irrational to the usual paradigm of treatment... our bodies just dont seem to respond to the treatment the way they should. Anyways, today im good. Have recovered from the Xmas food finally.

[java]

Yes there are a lot of doctors and non doctors with many claims, but don't dismiss someone because of his lack of credentials or you just might miss out on something good. The hard part is sorting through all these practitioners to find the right one for you. One of the most impressive healers I know has no medical degrees at all. It's not easy sometimes, but being open minded is a real benefit.

[neil25]

This is the most common way to treat chronic fatigue with yoga and nutrition. But when there is no medication this is the only option really, but to say it cures cfs would be totally crazy. We still need more research from doctors.

[annie]

several others are trying the protocol with mike dessin's dr now. it seems to be radical detoxification, injections, iv's etc. the dr who is in idaho seems to be a one off. if anyone is interested there is a blog by someone who is doing it, he explains it all well. sorry i can't do a link thing but it is ...
pathogensoup.blogspot.com there are others doing it on his sidebar.

[billoddie]

There is a lot to be said for detoxification. I'm not sure if I read it here or elsewhere, but the body cannot detox effectively UNLESS it is in parasympathetic mode of the nervous system. CFS sufferers are generally not parasympathetic. Gupta makes this point. His protocol assists in fundamentally returning the body to parasympathetic. A few years back, I noticed that whenever i drank any alcohol or had cakes etc,the next day (as well as the usual fatigue etc), my body just felt SO SO toxic. I am doing some detox measures, but I plan on doing some more powerful measures such as colonics and liver/gallbladder flush. Dr John Franzi diagnosed last year that my body was STILL storing and sporadically releasing THC. This is despite the fact i have not had marijuana for 6 yrs. Obviously the body's detoxification systems/pathways are severly compromised. Gupta has been working spendidly, but the last few days i have been exposed to some extra stress and so i have regressed a little. Still dont know how to make Gupta "stick" in these instances.

[Chronicfatiguetreatments]

There is a lot to be said for detoxification.

I respond well to detoxes. I used to do this lemon juice, olive oil, and garlic liver cleanse. It is not easy to drink, but it did help me. Alot of other cleanses and detoxes do make me feel better. I havent really done one for a while though.
Here's the recipie for the cleanse if you feel brave.
http://www.chronicfatiguetreatments.com ... ver-flush/

[billoddie]

Thanks heaps for that feedback. That is the exact detox I have been meaning to do but wasnt sure if was really worth it. Good to hear from someone who has done it.

[billoddie]

i retract everything I said about Mike Dessin...this guy had it waay bad. What i find interesting is not so much the actual details of the protocol, but the key is that he acknowledges that the amygdala has been damaged from any of a number of viruses such as cmv and how that the amygdala in turn, then goes on to screw up the hpa axis. This is compatible with guptas theory and helps to explain why some people get various avenues of relief with the gupta protocol but their fatigue itself remains largely untouched. (virus damage which cannot be addressed by retraining alone) About 12 months ago, I was treated for various viruses such as cmv, hpv 6 and the coxsackie. This was done via specialised homeopathics. i wonder if I would have achieved the same result with gupta had i not addressed these viruses first. At the moment, i am still 100% fatigue free. I still have some mood issues which I am slowly working through. i guess my main point is, the role of the amygdala has once again been considered. News is also that the Mayo clinic is doing a study on the effectiveness of guptas amygdala retraining, and gupta has written a new article on how he sees the xmrv virus as being compatible with his amygdala theory. By hook or by crook...i think the puzzle is unravelling.

[mari1]

billoddie, what treatment did you do for coxsackie, ebv, hh6v etc. I seems to be high on Igg on those too and cant seems to shake off any of it? thanks