Today i was reading material about chronic fatigue syndrome and energy cycles in the body. I was wondering if in certain cfs patients that may have depleted atp, if the nutritional supplement creatine would be of any benefit. Creatine is used by athletes to increase muscle energy and allow them to perform at their peak.
It works by increasing the amount of ATP in the muscles. It is made mostly in the liver out of 3 amino acids arginine, glycine, and methionine. Since many doctors believe that cfs patients have low levels of atp, maybe creatine could provide extra energy to the muscles and increase the overall well being of patients.
I know from experience that chronic fatigue patients have many other problems in addition to low muscle energy, but maybe the extra energy boost from the atp can have an effect on the other dysfunctional systems in the body. I know there is a relationship between atp and a sleep inducing molecule called adenosine. When a molecule of atp is used as energy, it loses a phosphate molecule and is turned into adenosine. Adenosine works on the brain in the complete opposite way that coffee does. (Here is an article about ATP, Adenosine and sleep) Maybe patients could increase energy, concentration, and stop insomnia by increasing atp with creatine.
I dont know if people with chronic fatigue are already trying this, or if this has been studied or not. Just a thought i was having today. If anyone has tried this or knows any more about this, feel free to post a comment on it.
Hello,
I just started taking Creatine for CFS. My reasoning is that it is connected to the ATP cycle that also uses D-Ribose and Glutamine. D-Ribose, in particular, is now being studied as a result of some very positive news posted by a surgeon that was disabled by CFS. She elected to try supplementing with D-Ribose and after 4 weeks was able to return to work.
A few months ago my symptoms were so bad that I applied for social security disability for the first time in my life (I’m 47) after having the disease since puberty. After reading the article by the surgeon I decided to try D-Ribose.
Having tried so many treatments with poor results, I wasn’t expecting too much. Very slowly, day by day, I began to notice improvement. After about 4 weeks I was working again.
In my experience this is certainly not a magic bullet, but it does help. If I had to quantify it, I would say 50% improvement on average. I’ve had days when I wake up actually feeling good, then other days where it seems it’s working very little. It’s been about 3 1/2 months since I started.
Just yesterday I started supplementing with Creatine because it is supposed to better maintain and stablize the ATP response to D-Ribose. It is also thought that Creatine converts ADP back into ATP which also helps sustain energy levels at the cellular level.
Of course the results of this are pending.
I didn’t see anywhere in this website where dates were posted with comments. This posting is dated 9/23/07.
If I can find my way back I will provide more information in a few weeks. If I can’t, please feel free to contact me at baileymtncrew@msn.com. I believe the only way we can beat this is to share information. As I share this email address I’m trusting, and request that this email not be given to any solicitors.
Thanks,
Jeff
Definately keep us updated. I think hearing information from people that are trying treatments and experimenting is the best way to find potential treatments. Also look into the yasko protocol. Im having some good results with that right now. I wrote some blog posts about it. Look under “simplified protocol”
thanks for the comment
What brand/kind of Creatine do you recomend?
Thanks,
David
I recently had a DNA testing with my Dr Gerber in Reno & Dr Wardley in Phoenix. With my results I was instructed to go on a low protein no sulfur diet. I recently went back on Meth B12 15,000 and Hydro B12, one shot a day. I still feel feeling tired,brain fog and I don’t know what to eat. Not satisfied with rice and veggies. Any help would be nice.
Thanks
my dna testing from dr. yasko says that i should avoid sulfur, but i dont have any sensativity to sulfites that i can tell.
I personally just go by what how i feel. If a doctor wants me to continue something even though i know it isnt working, i stop it. Unless i think i may take a while for the effects to kick in.
Right now im on the hydrox b12, l-methionine, phosphadytl serine complex, choline, NAC and folapro. These are definately helping me right now. Clears my head up alot.
I started taking creatine, glutamine and fish oils pretty much all at the same time. Combined with plenty of sleep, I have noticed some pretty decent results. There’s a definite reduction in the brain fog and light-headedness. I have more energy in the morning, but I still get tired pretty early. It’s hard to say which one has helped the most.
If you’re like me, you’ve also suffered a loss of weight and strength. At the very least, creatine will definitely help with that.
CFS, ME, fybromyalgia and many other diseases are probably caused primarily by problems with milk, gluten and secondary with sugar, phenols, silfite, etc.
In cowmilk and gluten there are morphin-like substances wich attach to mu-opioidreceptor that causes an upregulation of adenosine (histamine, etc) which causes downregulation of serotonin, dopamine and methionine cycle which causes sulphation problems, etc.
It’s probably the adenosine that causes brainfog.
There’s a synergy between the high adenosine and the mu-opioidreceptorsystem (the morphins in gluten and bread).
After 1 week of diet (no gluten, no cowmilk, low sugar) I am depression-free, have a flat stomach, warm feet and perfect eyesight again since 5 years (I eat essener bread in stead of regular bread, goat milk, no sugars, glutenfree pasta’s). But not sleeping wel yet, now trying to achieve that by enhancing methionine cycle (methylB12, folic acid, methionine,TMG, etc), this also lowers adenosine.
It’s the same problem as with autism, but there are many different gene problems possible for these problems (probably different in autism). Of course, in autism the problem occurs on a much more crucial time in development of brain and are much more intens.
Search the web for GFCF diet combined with SCD diet and low-carb.
Try if it helps. Good luck.
Note: other issues might be involved too, but this is as far as I am right now.
About my previous comment: in trying to limit myself to the most essential I forgot a few things.
First, because of the low (functional) beta-endorphin, the immune system is weak so that viruses and bacteria get a chance. They also contribute to the problem, for example streptococcus and mycoplasma both enhance adenosine.
Second, when you try the diet you will notice you sleep less. You can compensate by eating two dinner spoons honey.
Let me explain: although there’s not a lot beta-galactosidase (because of the high adenosine), still some monosaccharides are being absorbed in the gut and will be converted in the liver to glycogen. At night, this glycogen is being converted back to glucose and put into the bloodstream. The perifere tissues (everything but the brain) become insulin resistant so that all of the glucose comes to benefit the brain. The brain can now “refuel”, and therefore has to go “offline”, this is what we call sleep.
By not consuming carbohydrates, we don’t get enough glycogen in the liver and that’s why we can’t sleep.
The body can make glucose out of proteins and fats, but that doesn’t doesn’t produce enough glycogen.
Since we have low beta-galactosidase, eating sugar would lower that even more.
Low beta-galactosidas means (like adenosine and histamine, see above) more allergy, inflammation, etc.
Also, “bad” bacteria and fungi thrive on the sugars (by the way: without these “bad” bacteria and fungi, we would be worse off, they actually help us produce and digest; but they also produce alcohol-like substances which give us a feeling of being constantly a little drunk).
So, while we shouldn’t eat sugars (di- and oligosaccharides), we can eat monosaccharides because they can be absorped easily in the gut. Honey contains a lot of these monosacchariden. This will help us sleep.
hi im marcus, iv had cfs for 15 years (29) and i was unable to work for 4 years.
I was able to slowly get back into the workforce as i started to exersize more, however this caused other problems.
I got into weightlifting and started using creatine and had tremendous results.
I find it only works well if exersizing (particularly weight training) and it removes most of the fibremyalga symptoms.
I still get tired, but i function a whole lot better on creatine. I know this because i cycle off it every 2 months.
Hi all!
As newly registered user i only want to say hi to everyone else who uses this board B-)
hi team,
The dribose seems like its getting good online testimonies. What i have been doing which is helping me not blow out when things suck is meditating. I have felt under attack from everything since having the fatigue and allowing myself to feel pain and suffer, yet express myself or just notice, while in my room, has helped me with the feelings of despair. It is very hard to do but very worthwhile.
Zinc has been helpful for me with my low blood pressure. Magnesium with calcium helps a little too. Echinacea is a good booster for chest constriction.
Short term doing bowen technique on myself and freeing the kidney/liver area and chest of tension has been great.
I experimented with this when I had CFS in 1997 and I don’t think there were any references to it on the web at that time. I’ve documented my experience on my website. I found as little as 1g per day was effective and for all I know even less may have been but I didn’t experiment.
I’ve suffering a bout of PVF at the moment which I hope is not going to be chronic and I’ve started taking creatine again.
I suffered from debilitating CFS when I was 35 (I’m now 47). I was bell-up in bed for nearly 3 years. Homeopathic doc helped quite a bit, but when I tried creatine (it had to be SUGAR-BASED powdered creatine–35 gms. per serving or it did nothing), I had PHENOM results. For those who need hope, I am back to work full-time, cardio every morning at 5am, and got back to competitive power-lifting. However, if I go off the creatine I start a downward spiral. I SWEAR by the stuff!
Hi folks,
My experience with creatine is very different. 12 years ago I decided to take the stuff to improve my body building and lifting capabilities in the gym. It worked, I increased in strength and piled on the bulk.
Then the worst thing of my life happened, as I also was prescribed a long course of antibiotics, whilst also taking multivitamine supplements. This mixture with creatine was toxic and was very dangerous infact – I came down with something that felt like serious flu but wasn’t – then was diagnosed with post viral fatigue syndrome and finally CFS. My thyroid at that time also went for a downward spiral.
Had I followed the advice on the tin to not take creatine over a prolonged period of time I may have been alright. I now just take multivitamins and minerals in liquid form as supplementation and that is it. 12 years later I am working as a school teacher but still suffer from a mild form of the disease. If you cannot function without creatine, there should be some serious health concerns.
Some months back – I used some L-carnitine in liquid from, not realising that it was creatine given to me by my Wife – had a fantastic strength workout, then had to go to bed for a couple of day with a stomach ache and headache. Although creatine is said to be a natural product, it is so concentrated that it can have adverse affects which I have suffered from.